iMiev not selling well?

[fjpod]

Yes...but there is one more thing the iMiev's got that the Spark doesn't.

The iMiev is available now. It's not a car of the future.

 

[fjpod]

http://www.complex.com/rides/2012/11/mitsubishi-doubles-down-on-us-market-hires-us-chairman-for-first-time-in-years

 

[Vike]

It's not wise to dismiss the Spark EV as a "car of the future," since it's likely to show up in numbers within the year; that's not a heck of a lot of time.

It's more relevant to note GM's talk of matching Focus Electric pricing, which is a bit of a joke. The Focus-E is the most expensive mass-market BEV currently available. While it has a messed up cargo area, it's probably still more useful and certainly more comfortable than a Spark EV. GM had better re-think their EV pricing all around - if they don't do something about the Volt soon, Ford's C-MAX Energi is going to start doing some real damage, providing most of the Volt's EV range for thousands less, in a more useful package, with better ICE-hybrid mileage.

So if we take GM's price musings at face value, this means the i-MiEV will remain inexpensive compared to other EVs. With GM giving a low-price strategy for the SparkEV a pass, the only EVs that challenge the i-MiEV's value proposition are Daimler's SmartED models (though seriously, no back seat and minimal storage really do seem wrong to me).

Pity - it seems the market is going to leave this slot open if Mitsu folds up their tent and goes home. Again, glad I got mine - I'm not sure how soon anyone else is going to be bringing a "cheapskate friendly" EV to the U.S. market.

[Update/correction: I mentioned it elsewhere, but I should also acknowledge here that Nissan has been dropping heavy hints that the 2013 lineup will include a trim level below the SV, eschewing some of the SV's less essential gewgaws. I was surprised to learn that the LED headlights alone add $1k to the price tag, and while I've never been impressed with rapidly obsoleted GPS nav systems being integrated into cars' center stacks, I find them doubly useless in cars that can't leave town in the first place, so good riddance to that as well. Considering that the Nissan guys are escaping the yen exchange rate problems by building batteries and cars in the U.S., it's not clear just how low they intend to go with a new "S" or "base" trim level, or if, as Mitsubishi does, they're going to let base car buyers add CHAdeMO as a standalone option (admittedly a less important feature if/when the SAE-blessed J1772-CCS takes off).

So bottom line is that Nissan may indeed have a "cheapskate friendly" Leaf in the lineup next year - we'll have to see where the numbers come in.]

 

[JoeS]

http://www.complex.com/rides/2012/11/mitsubishi-doubles-down-on-us-market-hires-us-chairman-for-first-time-in-years

Pity the author lumped the iMiEV into the "non-competitive" discussion as it IS the lowest-cost mainstream EV available. Wonder what the new chairman's perspective is?

 

[JoeS]

Took my son and family out for brunch on his birthday this morning and parked the iMiEV close to the entrance to a very popular coffee shop in San Jose, and sat at a table where I could watch the car. You would not believe the number of people who detoured and stopped to inspect the car - walked around it, peered into it, and then carried on long animated conversations about it. I should have put my 'information' placard in the window.

I swear, people just don't know our little iMiEV even exists!

 

[Vike]

You would not believe the number of people who detoured and stopped to inspect the car - walked around it, peered into it, and then carried on long animated conversations about it. I should have put my 'information' placard in the window.

I swear, people just don't know our little iMiEV even exists!

EXACTLY! I am both puzzled and a bit peeved when I read that Mitsubishi has been "disappointed" by i-MiEV sales. When they have done approximately nothing to promote or even announce the vehicle, I can't say I'm surprised when people ask me what this thing is that I'm driving and then are surprised to hear that Mitsubishi has an electric car (we'll put aside the somewhat smaller group that wasn't aware Mitsubishi was still selling in the U.S. at all - ouch!). In the early days, I remember hearing that they planned to market the car "virally" through social media etc., but if you've visited their web site or Facebook page, you know that never really amounted to much either. Heck, when the National Plug-In Day event took place here in Santa Fe NM (a city with no Mitsu dealer, btw), neither Mitsubishi corporate nor the dealership in Albuquerque (the closest to the event) could be bothered to flat-bed a car up to show to the assembled EV enthusiasts and folks curious about the tech.

Given Mitsu's investment in creating this North American version of the i, I have great difficulty understanding their tepid efforts to get this car in front of customers. With rumors now swirling that a next-gen version is canceled and the American i-MiEV may not be long for this world, why they would effectively surrender and withdraw from the field without ever firing a shot is just a mystery - I'd love to hear/read the inside story of what the heck happened with this project.

 

[peterdambier]

I did not know the i-MiEV existed, until my wife bought one.

We always wanted to test drive but we did not find an electric car, but a few small exotic things on 3 wheels mostly and nothing to lend for a test.

The other car wanted to see the repair shop again and construction works made us take a detour. That is when "Little Snowwhite" stepped on our foot and asked us for a test drive. A month later she was ours.

Today (4 month later) we have become experts in electric cars and in finding mains power sockets to charge from. Good for my work in the county council. Good for advertising too and advertising we do.

 

[Vike]

OK, so things seem better than they did a few days ago, on a couple of fronts. As discussed elsewhere, this link to an updated i-MiEV promotional video:

http://insideevs.com/mitsubishi-premieres-worldwide-promotional-video-on-i-miev/

. . . includes these encouraging comments:

Despite not having intentions of making a 2nd generation of the i-MiEV, it appears (thankfully) that Mitsubishi has no short term plans to discontinue the car completely . . .

So while Mitsu may see little reason to invest any further in offerings for an elusive BEV market, at least they're not making noises about ditching the BEV they've developed. Alas, this probably means the Leaf will leave the i-MiEV behind with improved battery and heater/heat-pump tech, so unless Mitsu's costs (hence pricing) come down, I'd guess the i-MiEV is unlikely to get past the 2014 model year. If they can make them cheap enough, though, it could survive a bit longer as a niche "econo-EV" product.

As far as the Spark is considered, GM's now making much more rational noises about pricing:
http://insideevs.com/chevrolet-spark-priced-under-25000-with-incentives/

. . . albeit still a bit vague:

The company says that the car packs “smart performance and connectivity technologies into an affordable five-door urban mini car designed to make the trip as electrifying as the destination. It will be priced under $25,000 with tax incentives.”

That's a far cry from Focus EV pricing, undercutting the Leaf by a good margin and getting very close to i-MiEV pricing, depending on options. If that price includes SAE Combo DC Fast Charge (as opposed to having it bundled in a pricey trim level upgrade), that's very competitive, and possibly good news for budget-minded EV customers that prefer to have a back seat (sorry Smart).

Then again, it looks like the SparkEV is "initially" for California and Oregon only. Uh oh. I smell a compliance car.

 

[jray3]

Looks like a sales record was set for the iMiEV in October- 42 cars! :|
http://insideevs.com/november-2012-plug-in-electric-vehicle-sales-report-card/

 

[danpatgal]

Looks like a sales record was set for the iMiEV in October- 42 cars! :|
http://insideevs.com/november-2012-plug-in-electric-vehicle-sales-report-card/

I suppose you mean November. Though it's not exactly lots of sales, it is some, and if they continue at this rate, they'll have a few thousand owners in two years time. I, like I think Don said, am glad we got ours when we did ... it doesn't look like anything in the next year or so will give the value, utility, or quality that this little EV gives.

 

[MitsuMike]

I truely believe that the vehicle is not selling well due to the fact of lack of advertising and the fact of range anxiety. When you get into a vehicle and you see that you can only go 42 more miles and it wont work people really get scared. If they would learn how to drive the vehicle as opposed to saying, "NO!" they could get a few more miles than normally. There are some people in the hill countries getting at around a 100 per charge because they use the options like the B mode and Eco, almost like they are shifting a Bolt Action. Here in Dallas there are tons of stations going up everywhere just people here need there huge SUV's and TEXAS EDITION KING SIZE XO RANCH STYLE EXTENDED CAB SUPERSIZED V8 Hemi Turbo Charged Gas Guzzlers! :evil: Sorry had to vent! :lol:

 

[DonDakin]

Well Hell has frozen over....

Or I actually heard the word "iMiev" on the radio yesterday here in Montreal. A Mitsubishi dealer radio ad was running and they mention or "check out the iMiev all new 100 percent electric car." at the end of the spot.

Well it's a start.

Don......

 

[jray3]

http://insideevs.com/in-anticipation-of-new-pricing-on-2013-leafs-nissan-offers-up-to-5500-off-2012s/

Yep, you saw that right- $5500 discounts on remaining 2012 LEAFs, bringing them under iMiEV MSRP. After surging to 42 sales in November, this could just about flatline iMiEV sales for December.

 

[alohart]

Yep, you saw that right- $5500 discounts on remaining 2012 LEAFs, bringing them under iMiEV MSRP. After surging to 42 sales in November, this could just about flatline iMiEV sales for December.

The article said "up to $5500", and that dealers might not pass all of that on to customers. A comment to this article said that many dealers don't have many Leafs in stock, so would these dealers be willing to sell their remaining Leafs at a $5,500 discount and have no Leafs in stock until 2013 models arrive?

Also, many Mitsubishi dealers are selling their i inventory at significant discounts off of MSRP. I have negotiated a discount of $2,135 off of MSRP for an SE. That's almost $1,000 less than the base model Leaf.

Still, the rebate reduces the price difference between a Leaf and an i considerably. But with apparent battery pack problems in warm climates, I wouldn't buy a 2012 Leaf myself. I also prefer the i's smaller size and lighter weight, so I wouldn't buy the new, less expensive 2013 Leaf model, either.

So I don't know how much this Leaf rebate will hurt the already very weak i sales rate.

 

[nt2w]

http://insideevs.com/in-anticipation-of-new-pricing-on-2013-leafs-nissan-offers-up-to-5500-off-2012s/

Yep, you saw that right- $5500 discounts on remaining 2012 LEAFs, bringing them under iMiEV MSRP. After surging to 42 sales in November, this could just about flatline iMiEV sales for December.

Which brings an interesting question (and maybe a separate topic eventually...):

If the price of the LEAF and MiEV were the same (or in this case, the LEAF were less), would you buy the Nissan instead?

Good question- several here (myself included) cited price as the major consideration for buying the i. If the LEAF were same/cheaper, I think I would buy the Nissan.

Reasons:

1. much larger user base (number of LEAFs on the road), which means ultimately more long-term support
2. Nissan is a much larger presence in the USA, and I'm pretty sure they'll be here 10 years from now
3. I don't live in the desert southwest, so battery pack cooling is not much of an issue
4. Not really a big factor, but range- 11 miles more EPA range, which is nice, but not critical
5. Higher level of trim- a little more comfort is nice (although I don't need the Nintendo dash and nav system)

 

[Don]

If I could have bought a Leaf for $1K less than our iMiEV, I would still have bought our car

I'd been (patiently) waiting to buy an EV and of course the Leaf was out first, but I never had any interest in even going down to test drive one. I don't care for the overall layout of the Leaf at all. I didn't want FWD, and the overall shape of the Leaf just leaves me cold. While the iMiEV is so funny looking it's just plain cute (IMO) the Leaf is just . . . . bland and ugly, at least to me

I'm glad I waited and got the i and it wouldn't have mattered at all to me if a Leaf was available for less money at the time. For those waiting to buy a Leaf, it sounds like your day may finally be here. I hope you don't experience any of the battery issues we've been reading about

Don

 

[tonymil]

Would I have bought the leaf if it had been the same price as the MiEV? I'm not sure. I never drove a Leaf because the price difference was so substantial. For me the biggest shortcomings of the MiEV are the small cabin space and the poor visibility out the rear. On the other hand I bought the MiEV with the view that it was an economical, interim ev. The MiEV is something to have until electric batteries are able to hold substantially more charge for substantially less cost. When that happens the ev won't just be a commuter car, it will be a full-time, take-it-out-on-the-road car. At that point, the bubble-shape MiEV with its high drag coefficient will become obsolete. My hope is and has been that in five years, when I'm done paying off the MiEV, there will be a $30,000 ev that will get me 150 to 200 miles on a charge with only 20 to 30 minutes to fully recharge; a car that will get me from Albany to Long Island in about the same time it now takes me with my gas car. I will then keep the MiEV for short drives and use the "future" car for long drives. That will be the end of the gas powered car for me. I can't wait.

So I do not regret buying the MiEV, it was the most economical ev available in May. In the 6 months I've had it I have driven it over 5,000 miles which means I have saved $500 by using electricity instead of gas and more importantly to me, instead of the 2.5 tons of CO2 I would have emitted using a gas engine, my MiEV's electricity usage put out about 1/3 of that - about .8 ton. I have avoided putting about 1.6 tons of CO2 in the atmosphere. I feel pretty good about that.

 

[jray3]

Would I have bought a LEAF for the same money? Probably yes. Even though the LEAF accelerates much faster, I enjoy the i driving experience more, but as the family's prime mover, my wife would've preferred more creature comforts, range, greater perceived safety, and the fifth seat.
I saw the i as more modifiable, fun to drive, cheaper, durable, less likely to go 'technically obsolete' and yes; cute in a pugly sort of way...
:roll:
Now north of 14,000 miles, should hit 15k within the first year.

 

[JoeS]

I'm getting pretty upset with naysayers continuing to harp on the high purchase price of electric vehicles. Not only are these innumerates incapable of doing a full cost-of-ownership analysis, but they ignore the fact that the average cost of a new vehicle in the United States is $30,303. :shock:

Hello, exactly how many vehicles are there with the unique distinction of being zero-emissions? Surely this counts for something, especially when compared with all the non-essential yet expensive trinkets and "features" being foisted on the populace? After all, most vehicles are used for either commuting or short-trip local errands, for which our iMiEV is ideally suited. I mean, leather seats in a rough-and-tumble workhorse car seems incongruous.

In this shallow consumer-oriented environment, perhaps Mitsubishi should revert to the tried-and-proven ad campaign showing beautiful young ladies swooning over our little iMiEV, accentuating its "cuteness"? Fiat ads come to mind... :roll:

 

[jray3]

http://insideevs.com/december-2012-plug-in-electric-vehicle-sales-report-card/

77 sold in December, one car more than a year ago... with heavy discounting :?

One thing that I think could help the market would be an EV loan similar to the PACE program for energy-efficient housing. Since EV drivers pay less for fuel and maintenance, their affordability ratios should be adjusted, allowing more folks to qualify for an EV loan (which still commands more interest than a hybrid loan, due to uncertain residual values).

Does anyone know of an existing loan along these lines?