DBMandrake
Posts: 286
Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 4:57 am
Location: Scotland

Re: my 2013 Peugeot iOn will not charge :(

Tue Oct 22, 2019 4:20 am

Fingers crossed it holds. :D

Did you decide to leave the caps exposed or re-pot them ?

I presume the potting is there to keep them still under vibration so if they're not re-potted a blob of glue from the body to the nearby frame might be a good idea..
- Simon

EV: 2011 Peugeot Ion
ICE: 1997 Citroen Xantia V6

misterbleepy
Posts: 224
Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2013 12:53 am
Location: Newquay, Cornwall, UK

Re: my 2013 Peugeot iOn will not charge :(

Thu Oct 24, 2019 3:36 am

DBMandrake wrote:Fingers crossed it holds. :D


Ta :-)

I used some squirty silicone conformal coating - though not as deep as the black stuff that was there before.
Not sure I understand why that area is potted, but there are other capacitors on the same board completely exposed.
Could it be a high voltage area?
I may open it up again and get busy with a hot glue gun ;-)
Keith B.
driving with the power of 15.667 kettles

kiev
Posts: 1228
Joined: Sun May 03, 2015 7:15 am
Location: The Heart o' Dixie
Contact: Website

Re: my 2013 Peugeot iOn will not charge :(

Thu Oct 24, 2019 6:39 am

i think the primary function of the potted regions, which i sometimes refer to as a doghouse (slang derivative of daughter board, box or housing), are to provide a thermal transfer path for the components within the fence.
kiev = kenny's innovative electric vehicle

kje
Posts: 1
Joined: Sat Nov 16, 2019 5:40 am

Re: my 2013 Peugeot iOn will not charge :(

Sat Nov 16, 2019 5:46 am

misterbleepy wrote:Image


Seems like same charge cable/EVSE as mine.

Mine will not always charge and I suspect the intake cable is broken. But how do I get of the wires without damage the rubber protection in the intake?
[img]
https://elbilforum.no/index.php?action= ... 1343;image
[/img]

misterbleepy
Posts: 224
Joined: Thu Apr 11, 2013 12:53 am
Location: Newquay, Cornwall, UK

Re: my 2013 Peugeot iOn will not charge :(

Mon Nov 25, 2019 8:11 am

kje wrote:Seems like same charge cable/EVSE as mine.

Mine will not always charge and I suspect the intake cable is broken. But how do I get of the wires without damage the rubber protection in the intake?
[img]
https://elbilforum.no/index.php?action= ... 1343;image
[/img]

I can't get to that link without a login, and my Norwegian isn't good enough for me to register for a userid.
There must be a way to take these apart and get them back together without breaking them, but I don't know how.
Maybe someone else on here has?
Keith B.
driving with the power of 15.667 kettles

DBMandrake
Posts: 286
Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 4:57 am
Location: Scotland

Re: my 2013 Peugeot iOn will not charge :(

Sun Feb 16, 2020 8:54 am

Well, it looks like I am the next victim of this onboard charger scurge. :(

My 2011 Ion at 59k miles has also had the onboard charger and DC/DC converter both stop working, and I'm piggybacking on this thread because I think (hope ?) my symptoms are a close match for mrbleepy's car.

I plugged the car in to charge on Friday night at about 25% state of charge, the car was not used on Saturday (so remained plugged in) and I then went to use it today on Sunday.

I'm clearly not very observant because I had driven 100 metres up the road before I noticed that I was only at about 70% SoC and had both the low 12 volt battery warning and electric vehicle warning light (yellow car with exclamation) on. Bugger! I turned right around and went back home and took the other car out for the day.

So the car still starts and drives, however the 12v battery is not being charged, so was measuring about 11.9 volts when I checked it with the car in READY - so clearly the DC / DC converter is not charging the 12v battery. I tried plugging the car in to charge and the battery pack fan blows briefly but it the gives up. I haven't tried Chademo charging.

Unlike many of those suffering with this problem I have a Diagbox system so I can get full fault codes and this is what I see:

OBC
02 - Charge fault (traction battery disconnected)
43 - Fault - electrical current too high in the inverter

When I first checked fault codes only code 43 was present, fault 02 didn't appear until after I attempted to charge the car.

BMU
P1A4B - Battery cells fault

EV_ECU
P1B31 - Brake fluid pressure sensor fault
P0A09 - Converter fault
P1A12 - Vehicle charging fault
P1A2F - Fault in the functioning of the cells of the traction battery

So I think it's pretty likely that the 20A fuse in the MCU (?) has blown causing both charging and DC/DC converter functions to stop. What remains to be seen is what else blew first to take out the fuse. Just the caps like mrbleepy would be nice, but from memory there are some resistors that can fail as well ?

Interestingly, I think my specific failure lends more weight to the "capacitors go short circuit first and then blow the fuse" theory because the car charged all the way from 25% to about 70% then spontaneously failed at that point, several hours into the charge. It didn't fail on charge start or due to an interruption to charging. (We don't get power cuts)

Also OBC code 43 tends to suggest a genuine over current situation (though the shorted capacitors) blew the fuse rather than fuse mechanical fatigue.

I'm pretty sure the fault codes relating to traction battery cells are bogus - Canion reports 68% SoC, cell voltages are well matched, all CMU's are reporting cell voltages and the car still drives.

Unfortunately this failure has happened at a very awkward time even if I can fix it, as the yearly MOT is due in under 4 weeks, also I was on the verge of replacing the car with a Nissan Leaf, and may have been using it as a part exchange and at the very least it was being sold to get some money back. If I can't fix it for a reasonable cost it will have to be sold for scrap! :(

What's my best course of action to try to fix this ASAP ? I'm inclined to order the fuse, caps and resistors immediately before even attempting to take the unit apart to minimise delays as time is really of the essence if I'm to get it fixed in time for the MOT.

Is the fuse only available through Mitsubishi or can it be ordered elsewhere ? I've had no dealings with Mitsubishi before. Also I don't suppose you have the details of where you ordered the caps from mrbleepy ?

As far as disassembly goes, I presume initially the best action is to remove the safety link plug under the seat then remove the top of both MCU and OBC to have a look at the fuse and caps ?

I put an intelligent 12v battery charger onto the 12v battery as soon as I noticed the fault, so I think I caught that before it discharged too much, and the traction battery is at about 70% which through luck is an ideal SoC for the car to sit unused for a few weeks.

One other question - when I do remove the OBC completely to replace the caps and check for other faults, what type of coolant is used in the cooling system for on board charger etc, and is there a specific refilling and bleeding process ? I think Diagbox has an actuator test mode that can turn on the coolant pump manually.

I've been following this onboard charger problem on the forum on and off for over a year and been dreading having it happen to me, but just as I was about to sell the car it has finally caught up with me...
- Simon

EV: 2011 Peugeot Ion
ICE: 1997 Citroen Xantia V6

kiev
Posts: 1228
Joined: Sun May 03, 2015 7:15 am
Location: The Heart o' Dixie
Contact: Website

Re: my 2013 Peugeot iOn will not charge :(

Sun Feb 16, 2020 10:32 am

What a shame, such rotten timing. But you have more tools than most to access and clear fault codes.

i made a repair with the OBC in the car, no need to remove anything unless you can't get a soldering iron out to the car.

The fuse and HV snubber caps can be found at Mouser, but to get the car working and driving until they come in you could just use a jumper to replace the fuse. The MCU fuse only provides protection for the short piece of cable between the OBC and the MCU. i drove my car using a jumper wire in place of the fuse until taking it in for OBC replacement. The jumper will allow the DCDC converter to recharge the aux battery. It's all in your comfort level versus risk management.

i bought a 30A 450V Littlefuse, 0HEV030.ZXISO (plus several other which were xrayed to examine the internal construction, pictures in the OBC thread).

The reason i believe the MCU fuse mechanically fails first is that there is a smaller 20A fuse on the OBC output between the snubber caps and the MCU fuse, which has never blown in anyone's OBC or MCU fuse failure.

Over time, the shock and vibrations while driving caused mechanical fatigue of the tiny thin copper fuse element seen in the xray photos which caused an open circuit situation that resulted in a very high inductive voltage spike that punched thru the snubber caps. This is the simplest explanation that covers all the damage and lack of damage found in most failures. There have been a few failures on the AC input side, but that is a different failure mode altogether with different components.

Some folks have replaced the fuse and snubber caps with good success. In my case damage also occurred in the semiconductors in the epoxy-coated waffle plate, which will require a plate transplant to repair.
kiev = kenny's innovative electric vehicle

DBMandrake
Posts: 286
Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 4:57 am
Location: Scotland

Re: my 2013 Peugeot iOn will not charge :(

Sun Feb 16, 2020 10:45 am

kiev wrote:What a shame, such rotten timing. But you have more tools than most to access and clear fault codes.

Yes having a dealer diagnostic tool certainly helps...
i made a repair with the OBC in the car, no need to remove anything unless you can't get a soldering iron out to the car.

I can get a soldering iron to the car no problem the issue is daylight - it's the middle of winter here so by the time I come home during the week it's pitch black so I would be working in the dark and cold outdoors trying to do delicate soldering work. I can certainly pull the covers off though to give it a visual inspection.
The fuse and HV snubber caps can be found at Mouser,

I'm guessing Mouser is a US parts chain as I've never heard of them in the UK. Mrbleepy is also in the UK so hopefully he sees this and lets me know where he ordered his from.
but to get the car working and driving until they come in you could just use a jumper to replace the fuse. The MCU fuse only provides protection for the short piece of cable between the OBC and the MCU. i drove my car using a jumper wire in place of the fuse until taking it in for OBC replacement. The jumper will allow the DCDC converter to recharge the aux battery. It's all in your comfort level versus risk management.

Doesn't that same fuse also pass the charging current from the onboard charger to the traction battery ?
i bought a 30A 450V Littlefuse, 0HEV030.ZXISO (plus several other which were xrayed to examine the internal construction, pictures in the OBC thread).

I found a link in a thread on speakev.com to where Mrbleepy ordered his fuse from so I have ordered two from here, although it may take a week or so for them to arrive:

https://www.amayama.com/en/part/mitsubishi/9499a656

I have another car to drive in the meantime (a petrol guzzler however!) so the only reason I would consider driving it with a jumper wire for the fuse would be to get it to the MOT test and back. However for that to work I would have already had to have replaced the snubber caps first.
Some folks have replaced the fuse and snubber caps with good success. In my case damage also occurred in the semiconductors in the epoxy-coated waffle plate, which will require a plate transplant to repair.

I'm crossing my fingers that it's just the snubber caps and fuse...!
- Simon

EV: 2011 Peugeot Ion
ICE: 1997 Citroen Xantia V6

DBMandrake
Posts: 286
Joined: Mon Mar 20, 2017 4:57 am
Location: Scotland

Re: my 2013 Peugeot iOn will not charge :(

Sun Feb 16, 2020 1:24 pm

Capacitors, fuse (x2) and conformal coating spray on order, caps and spray should be here in a couple of days, fuses look like they may take a week to 10 days or so.

Farnell and Mouser both didn't have the caps in stock (weeks or months until new supplies) but I found them in stock at Radio spares.

Tomorrow night after work if it's not raining I'm going to pull the front seat out to remove the link plug and pull the top covers off both MCU and OBC to have a close look and confirm what the issue is.

Is there any kind of RTV sealant on the top lids that will need replacing afterwards or is it just a regular re-usable gasket or o-ring ?
- Simon

EV: 2011 Peugeot Ion
ICE: 1997 Citroen Xantia V6

Gary12345
Posts: 50
Joined: Tue Feb 12, 2019 4:15 am
Location: Essex, UK

Re: my 2013 Peugeot iOn will not charge :(

Sun Feb 16, 2020 2:21 pm

The lids of the boxes under the boot have a sealant type stuff on, its not a gasket. You prise the lid off and it breaks the seal.

Also the orange "fuse" under the passenger seat can be removed without taking the seat out - just push it back as far as it will go and its possible to unbolt the cover and remove the fuse. If you do remove the seat it can put the airbag light on, which then needs resetting to turn it off. Not exactly a major issue but can be an annoyance if you don't have the correct diagnostic tool to do so.

Cheers.

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