jray3
Posts: 1512
Joined: Tue Dec 06, 2011 1:05 am
Location: Tacoma area, WA
Contact: Website

Re: Failed traction battery. How many weeks does Mitsubishi make you wait?

Wed Jan 17, 2018 1:49 pm

David Patterson was the US Mitsu Engineer who brought the car here and was a regular at the EV Roadmap Conference in 2012-14, but hasn't been in the last few years. I'm not sure he's still with the company, but would be a great inside contact if we could coaxe him out of the shadows.
https://insideevs.com/mitsubishi-chief-engineer-talks-future-electric-drive-us-videos/
2012 i-SE "MR BEAN" 89,000 miles
2012 i-ES traded at 21,648 miles
1983 Grumman Kurbwatt,170 kW, 32 kWh
1983 Mazda RX-7 EV 43 kW 10 kWh
1971 "Karmann Eclectric" EV 240 kW 19 kWh
1965 Karmann Ghia Cabriolet

JoeS
Site Moderator
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Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:47 am
Location: Los Altos Hills, California

Re: Failed traction battery. How many weeks does Mitsubishi make you wait?

Thu Jan 18, 2018 11:18 pm

Oh for goodness sake! This is the first instance that I am aware of in North America that Mitsubishi has balked at the replacement of a defective battery pack.

Of course, the negligible 12v power draw of the diesel heater has nothing to do with the main pack, as any competent professional engineer can attest to!

Any additional battery testing should be covered by Mitsubishi as part of their battery functionality investigation.

You have the advantage of knowing what the cell readings are.

If it were me, I would attempt to escalate this matter within the Mitsubishi chain of command. Also, I'd start off by having the dealer provide a written statement regarding their reason for not honoring the battery warranty and their insisting that you pay for the additional battery testing.

obrother, I find your situation very disturbing, as up until now Mitsubishi has been stellar about standing behind the battery warranty.

Perhaps some of our Canadian owners can offer some advice, as Canadian consumer protections are different than US?

obrother, please keep us advised of your progress, and wish you all the best.
EVs: 2 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 Tesla MS85, 3 156v CorbinSparrows (2 Li-ion), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab 96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
ICE: '88 Isuzu Trooper. Mothballed: '67 Saab (orig.owner), '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

phb10186
Posts: 290
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Location: North London suburbs, UK

Re: Failed traction battery. How many weeks does Mitsubishi make you wait?

Fri Jan 19, 2018 12:51 am

Do the battery warranty terms state 'vehicle not covered if modified in any way' - or words to that effect?

This is a common wriggle-out clause.
2012 I-MIEV Keiko Silver 16K
2010 Insight ES-T 43K
2001 Accord Type-V (F23 manual)
2009 Hornet CB600F
2008 SH300

sandange
Posts: 884
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:21 am
Location: Quebec, Canada
Contact: Website

Re: Failed traction battery. How many weeks does Mitsubishi make you wait?

Fri Jan 19, 2018 5:09 pm

If anything, the diesel heater would take some stress off of the traction battery allowing fewer
charging / discharging cycles.
Last edited by sandange on Mon Jan 29, 2018 12:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Puey Bluey 2014 Miev
103.768 miles, 167,000 km
Previous EVs
Blackie - 2012 ES Miev 2 years - 67,000 km / (41,630 miles)
Total Electric miles driven 145,400 miles (234,000 km)
http://thecordstead.blogspot.ca/

obrother
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:13 pm
Location: GTA Ontario, Canada

Re: Failed traction battery. How many weeks does Mitsubishi make you wait?

Sat Jan 20, 2018 6:10 am

I called Mitsubishi Motors Canada customer service yesterday. It was the same guy trying to give me the runaround and again telling me to talk to the dealer. I kept pushing hard that I have been without a car for six weeks...and that I will have to pay 6 hours of diagnostics which is about 900 cdn dollars when I was able to diagnose the car in 2 minutes...and that I am having to rent a car as well. Finally he caved and said he will contact the dealer. About 2 hours later he called me back and told me the dealer service advisor apologizes for the delay...and then he went on mentioning the bad weather, holidays, only one service tech, engineering is in japan etc etc. Then he told me that because I made a modification to the electrical system by installing a diesel parking heater that they need to do the 5 additional hours of diagnostics to determine if it caused damage to the cell. He left me no room for discussion he just rambled off what he need to and told me that there should be a determination by the middle of next week.

Thanks for all the interest guys... the irony is that I was trying to extend the life of the traction battery by adding the diesel heater...and did so because of the pack had already lost range...probably due to the failing of cell 81. I was also not wanting to freeze my ass off in the winter when it gets below -20c with the cars shitty little electric heater... nor did I want to get stranded in a snow storm due to an empty battery or failure. There you go guys... touch the electric system on your car and when you bring your car in the dealer together with mitsubishi will try to burn your ass!!! :shock:

kiev
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Location: The Heart o' Dixie
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Re: Failed traction battery. How many weeks does Mitsubishi make you wait?

Sat Jan 20, 2018 8:40 am

Such a shame that they know so little about how the car systems work. Hopefully they will realize it after they examine the cabin heater, and will charge it off against the warranty work when replacing the pack.

If they don't offer as much i would press and ask them to do that as goodwill especially since there is not a credible link between a diesel heater and a bad cell. No need for you to pay for them to learn about electric cars, they have training classes for that.
kiev = kenny's innovative electric vehicle

sandange
Posts: 884
Joined: Thu Jul 05, 2012 2:21 am
Location: Quebec, Canada
Contact: Website

Re: Failed traction battery. How many weeks does Mitsubishi make you wait?

Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:06 am

So with the dealers reasoning anything drawing power off of the 12v battery risks your traction battery guarantee. What's next you can't do, plug in your cell phone , electric blanket, seat heater cushion?
6 weeks without a diagnosis or your car is irresponsible .
Sorry this is a sore spot for me having experienced similar neglect with my first I miev
Puey Bluey 2014 Miev
103.768 miles, 167,000 km
Previous EVs
Blackie - 2012 ES Miev 2 years - 67,000 km / (41,630 miles)
Total Electric miles driven 145,400 miles (234,000 km)
http://thecordstead.blogspot.ca/

JoeS
Site Moderator
Posts: 3508
Joined: Thu Dec 15, 2011 5:47 am
Location: Los Altos Hills, California

Re: Failed traction battery. How many weeks does Mitsubishi make you wait?

Sat Jan 20, 2018 9:13 am

obrother, can you find a way past the customer service representative in order to escalate the matter within the Mitsubishi organization? Surely there is someone there who understands the pseudo-technical nonsense that is being spewed and will realize what the outcome will be if it's taken to court.

This is potentially a big-ticket item so you rightfully need to tread carefully. Before turning the car over to the dealer, here's the approach I would take -

1. Obtain written statement from the dealer explaining the rationale for the additional testing required and their assessment of what they believe the impact of this accessory (the diesel heater) has had on the battery pack, and why YOU have to pay for the testing. If they don't want to put it into writing, pull out a camera or smart phone and insist that they give you that reasoning on-camera.

2. Insist on a presentation and analysis from the dealer of all the possible results of this testing and why those results would not be covered by the battery warranty. It would be good to record and also have someone technically knowledgeable with you for this discussion.

3. If you are required to pay for this additional testing, obtain, in writing, a statement from them stating that they will refund your testing costs as part of the warranty coverage. I would be very reluctant to go this way because I challenge that in (2) above they can show that the cell failure was caused by anything external to the pack.

Before turning the car over to them I would be inclined to challenge them in small claims court over the cost of this additional battery testing.

Is there not a consumer protection agency in Canada? I would contact them for advice as to how you should proceed.

In the US we have the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act. For example, extracting from the following link:

https://www.consumerreports.org/cro/news/2014/06/can-an-aftermarket-part-void-my-car-warranty/index.htm

The Federal Trade Commission says, “The manufacturer or dealer must show that the aftermarket or recycled part caused the need for repairs before denying warranty coverage.”

Just out of curiosity, how much 12v current does that diesel heater draw?

All this is beginning to leave a bad taste in my mouth regarding Mitsubishi (only Mitsubishi Canada?); I still have to believe it's the result of technically un-knowledgeable individuals in the decision-making chain.
EVs: 2 Wht/Blu SE Prem., '13 Tesla MS85, 3 156v CorbinSparrows (2 Li-ion), 24v EcoScoot(LiFePO4)
EV Conv: 156v '86 Ram PU, 144v '65 Saab 96
Hybrids: 48v1kW bike
ICE: '88 Isuzu Trooper. Mothballed: '67 Saab (orig.owner), '76 MBZ L206D RHD RV

obrother
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:13 pm
Location: GTA Ontario, Canada

Re: Failed traction battery. How many weeks does Mitsubishi make you wait?

Sun Jan 21, 2018 4:11 pm

Oversized tires or wrong size tires can get you in trouble with the dealer/mitsubishi with a traction battery failure?

http://myimiev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=3877&start=20#p34751

http://myimiev.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=3877&start=20#p34870

obrother
Posts: 34
Joined: Tue Jul 12, 2016 12:13 pm
Location: GTA Ontario, Canada

Re: Failed traction battery. How many weeks does Mitsubishi make you wait?

Fri Jan 26, 2018 12:44 pm

Just finished talking to the dealer...another week has gone by... the dealer requested a mitsubishi electric car specialist to examine to the car. The specialist is expected to come this tuesday and hopefully then they can give me an answer on how Mitsubishi will handle my warranty claim and how to proceed.

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