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TaosEV

Well-known member
Joined
Apr 14, 2012
Messages
68
James R. Healey reviews the i and makes all the same comparisons to ICEs:

http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/reviews/healey/story/2012-06-16/test-drive-james-healey-mitsubishi-i/55602302/1

Just amazing to me how many people don't get it!

As a retired marketing guy, this tells me Mitsubishi needs to put some oomph into its marketing for the i and explain to (educate) consumers on the ways in which the car fits specific needs. Continued false comparisons to ICEs will kill the product.
 
TaosEV said:
James R. Healey reviews the i and makes all the same comparisons to ICEs:

http://www.usatoday.com/money/autos/reviews/healey/story/2012-06-16/test-drive-james-healey-mitsubishi-i/55602302/1

Just amazing to me how many people don't get it!

As a retired marketing guy, this tells me Mitsubishi needs to put some oomph into its marketing for the i and explain to (educate) consumers on the ways in which the car fits specific needs. Continued false comparisons to ICEs will kill the product.

I'm not sure if the problem here is false ICE comparisons as much as false mid-size car comparisons. I mean, the i's ride is "choppy"? Compared to WHAT? A Camry, sure. But a Yaris, I don't think so. I've got nothing against the Prius C, great ICE product, but around town I found it noticeably rougher than the i.

Given the i's tiny footprint, I think its ride is surprisingly smooth, though probably at the expense of abandoning any pretensions of "go-kart" handling. That's an OK trade-off for me.

As I've said before, though, I think Mitsu's lack of advertising support is consistent with rumors that they're losing money on every sale. Their stated sales target for 2012 is quite modest, and something they're likely to hit just grabbing the low-hanging fruit of budget-minded EV enthusiasts. I don't think falling a little short of even that target is going to cost them much sleep, so I'm not expecting an advertising push until next year at the earliest.
 
Inasmuch as I disagree with many of Healey's opinions and started making a detailed rebuttal to his comments, I've decided that life is too short to waste...

I mean, how do you respond to statements saying that the "i" looks and corners like an "egg in heels"?

I did like his comment about Mitsubishi's Level 1 EVSE being "...apparently designed by nervous lawyers", referring to it only drawing 8A at 120vac. Even so, I use that EVSE for most of my own daily charging instead of my more-powerful Level 2 EVSE.

To Healey's credit, he did like the straightforward instrumentation and the low noise level, but didn't mention the many other attributes of the iMiEV. Pity.

I just hope that people seriously interested in owning a truly functional electric vehicle as a daily driver have the desire and ability to evaluate the iMiEV objectively for themselves. We're certainly happy to answer questions on this forum.
 
I think Mitsu's apparent lack of enthusiastic advertising is probably due to their inability to import cars fast enough to even fulfill their reserved orders for now. The only thing worse than not advertising the car would be to create all kinds of interest they can't keep up with - They already have lots of irritated folks who put down deposits and are having to wait way longer than they would like to get a car. I *suspect* that this may be due to the fact that they're just now getting their new battery factory up to speed - Once they can make batteries faster than they can sell cars, I suspect we'll see lots more advertising for the car. As it now stands, one test drive is all it takes for many people to place an order . . . . *IF* they could quickly get a car, but they can't in many cases, at least not around here

My local dealer got in 4 cars all at once - From what he says, each distributor here in the south who was interested enough to get a few people trained was supposed to initially get just 2 cars. Another nearby dealership didn't get their training done in time, so my guy got their 2 cars in addition to his alloted 2. He sold 3 of the cars (mine was one) within about 3 weeks, thanks to some local TV advertising and he won't sell the 4th one as he's using it as a demo to take orders. He currently has 8 more cars on order and already has commitments for most of those, but he can't get them nearly as quickly as he'd like. The owner of the dealership is really hot on selling EV's . . . . if he could just get more of them quicker, he'd be tickled

Don
 
That's great news, Don. If Mitsu would offer a 120V 60 Hz version of their emergency inverter that was deployed in the Tsunami zone, the i could gain quickly in hurricane zones. Stockpiling and/or scavenging gasoline before/after every hurricane ain't fun!
 
Don said:
I think Mitsu's apparent lack of enthusiastic advertising is probably due to their inability to import cars fast enough to even fulfill their reserved orders for now.

That is not the case.
 
I have been thinking about a Mitsubishi inverter running from the CHAdeMo Socket, but Mitsubishi are not bringing them in yet.

I thought how could I get round this and thought why not do like I do for electric hedge trimming on jobs where no power is available...I use my 2.5 Kw inverter and run it off my car batteries or a big Gell battery of 100 amp hour capacity, note though I am only drawing 500 watts which is about 42 amps, plus the hedge trimmer is on trimming then and off as I clear the debrie, so an hour of hedge trimming is often only on for say 30 minutes. Thats only 20 amps out of the battery, about the same as leaving the headlights on for an hour.

The car has two 70 amp hour batteries, Hilux car, so only 10 amps out of each battery during the hour hedge trimming which is well within ok draw.

Plus the motor is often running on the car to keep the battery charge up.


Thinking the same way with the iMiEV, I note the car battery, the 12 volt one for lights and accessories is recharged when the car is switched to on, via the main battery charging the 12 volt battery. This 12 volt battery could then be wired to a inverter to provide mains power, and even at 240 volts say 1, 500 watts like the one that mitsubishi make for the CHAdeMo socket, The draw off the 12 volt battery would be 125 amps, andI guess one wouldn't be drawing that all the time.

Say hooking it up for say making toast and coffee, it would be only on for say 20 minutes tops. That is about 42 amp / hrs. THat would be about the full capacity of the iMiEV 12 battery, but if the Main battery was charging the 12 volt one, that would be only a 504 watt draw or about half a bar.

Thing is, what is the max current supplied to the iMiEV 12 battery by the charger circuit from the main battery when the power is set to key on ?

If it is similar to a petrol car, then it would be around 55 amps at about 13.8 volts. That is 759 watts, so could supply the inverter load periodically, but not continuously.

If they have a bigger charge rate available say 150 amps, then a 1, 500 watt inverter could be run continuously, until the main pack was flat which would be about 10 hours.

Anyone know the charge rate to the 12 volt battery from the main battery when the key is on ?

allowing for headlights at 100 watts each, thats 200 watts, wiper, say averages 50 watts, radio, navigation and fan are together say 100 watts, and de-mister and heated seats are together, say 200 watts, I am not sure as I haven't checked, but say about that much, in total if all were on at once, it would be 550 watts which at 13.8 volts is about 40 amps.

So I would guess that Mitsubishi have allowed for that and fitted a 12 volt charging circuit to around 50 amps.

I saw a minicab iMiEV video on youtube that showed a guy with not less than four 12 volt sockets fitted and an inverter, he was running foot warmers, phone chargers, gps, an electric blanket, a ceramic heater ! and other bits...
 
iMiEVNZ7 said:
Thinking the same way with the iMiEV, I note the car battery, the 12 volt one for lights and accessories is recharged when the car is switched to on, via the main battery charging the 12 volt battery. This 12 volt battery could then be wired to a inverter to provide mains power, and even at 240 volts say 1, 500 watts like the one that mitsubishi make for the CHAdeMo socket, The draw off the 12 volt battery would be 125 amps, and I guess one wouldn't be drawing that all the time.
To pull 125 amps, you'd need some HUGE wire . . . . much bigger than anything the car uses to keep the 12 volt battery charged. Plus, you'd run into another big problem . . . . the DC to DC converter in the car which charges the 12 volt battery off the 330 volt pack is rated at 80 amps max . . . . and I seriously doubt it could do that continuously for very long without overheating. If you burn that out, I predict it will be expensive - Much more than just building a 330 volt 1500 watt inverter from scratch

1500 watts off the CHAdeMo 330 volt power socket is less than 5 amps - A much more practical way to do it. You just need to build yourself a 330 volt inverter . . . . I bet you could do it for a couple hundred bucks - Getting 1500 watts using only 5 amps is much simpler to do than using 125 amps, and it will run much, much cooler too - That means higher efficiency

Don
 
UnderPSI said:
Don said:
I think Mitsu's apparent lack of enthusiastic advertising is probably due to their inability to import cars fast enough to even fulfill their reserved orders for now.

That is not the case.
Please fill us in - Why are they not advertising the car more agressively then? Why are so many people who preordered cars still waiting for a car? My dealer got in only 4 cars initially (and 2 of those were destined for another dealership which did not get training done on time) and he quickly sold 3 of those 4 and is holding on to the 4th one using it as a demo, to take orders from customers - He's getting orders, but he can't get any cars to fill them

So . . . . what is the case?

Don
 
Don said:
1500 watts off the CHAdeMo 330 volt power socket is less than 5 amps - A much more practical way to do it. You just need to build yourself a 330 volt inverter . . . . I bet you could do it for a couple hundred bucks - Getting 1500 watts using only 5 amps is much simpler to do than using 125 amps, and it will run much, much cooler too - That means higher efficiency

But nobody's hacked the signal to energize the CHAdeMO pins yet, IIRC. (They aren't hot all the time, are they? I've only verified that in a Leaf, since my i has no CHAdeMO). So, I want to add an Anderson connector to the HV harness. Have had trouble so far identifying the connectors used at the charger output and inverter input, so as to get more and build a pigtail. Going for a direct pack connection would involve a bit more digging.

I picked up a surplus UPS unit that takes 240 VDC input, which on lead acid sees a max of about 290 VDC. Our 330V may be a bit high...
 
Don said:
UnderPSI said:
Don said:
I think Mitsu's apparent lack of enthusiastic advertising is probably due to their inability to import cars fast enough to even fulfill their reserved orders for now.

That is not the case.
Please fill us in - Why are they not advertising the car more agressively then? Why are so many people who preordered cars still waiting for a car? My dealer got in only 4 cars initially (and 2 of those were destined for another dealership which did not get training done on time) and he quickly sold 3 of those 4 and is holding on to the 4th one using it as a demo, to take orders from customers - He's getting orders, but he can't get any cars to fill them

So . . . . what is the case?

Don

I can't go into specifics but someone close to me owns a Mitsubishi dealership and I can assure you that the lack of advertising has nothing to do with inability to fill orders. There are many unsold cars sitting in port and have been there for months. I had initially ordered a white one but upon seeing the silver, I liked it better. A phone call found 3 cars fitting my requirements sitting in port, unsold and unreserved. I had the one I liked shipped and picked it up 2 days later. I bought mine in June and it had been sitting in port (U.S.) since April. There are still at least 3 others sitting at a local dealer here, unsold since March.

If your local dealer can't locate cars, he's not trying hard enough or doesn't know who to contact.
 
The two dealers near me have i's in stock...not many, but they are sitting there. And at least one dealer is moving on price.
 
Vike said:
As I've said before, though, I think Mitsu's lack of advertising support is consistent with rumors that they're losing money on every sale. Their stated sales target for 2012 is quite modest, and something they're likely to hit just grabbing the low-hanging fruit of budget-minded EV enthusiasts. I don't think falling a little short of even that target is going to cost them much sleep, so I'm not expecting an advertising push until next year at the earliest.
I was shocked - shocked, I tell you - while listening to a podcast of Saturday's Wait, Wait…Don't Tell Me! on NPR to hear an ad for a Mitsubishi "i-MiEV" (the ad didn't call it an 'i'). Unfortunately, I haven't been able to find this ad to listen to it again. Maybe Mitsubishi has been advertising the i on NPR for some time, but I have never before heard an i ad anywhere. Could Mitsubishi finally be starting an ad campaign, maybe to help move the many i's languishing on dealer lots?
 
alohart said:
I was shocked - shocked, I tell you - while listening to a podcast of Saturday's Wait, Wait…Don't Tell Me! on NPR to hear an ad for a Mitsubishi "i-MiEV" (the ad didn't call it an 'i'). Unfortunately, I haven't been able to find this ad to listen to it again. Maybe Mitsubishi has been advertising the i on NPR for some time, but I have never before heard an i ad anywhere. Could Mitsubishi finally be starting an ad campaign, maybe to help move the many i's languishing on dealer lots?
Mitsubishi i-Miev: iMiEV Electric Billboard
http://adsoftheworld.com/media/outdoor/mitsubishi_imiev_imiev_electric_billboard
 
I like that ad.

The dealership in Hamilton, Ontario just began selling i-MiEVs after recently becoming i-MiEV certified. If there was any truth to the rumor, then I'm not sure why they would bother becoming i-MiEV certified. I spoke with the dealership president recently and he said they are in works with local governments to sell them i-MiEVs. I can't imagine he would try to sell them cars that won't be around next year.
 
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